Hello there again.
I agree with your POVs. But, if you don’t mind, I’d like to clarify.
While I agree that he has done some movements in order to decrease state job abuse, he has done it in a way which left 150.000 families without a job. That a lot of people sadly. He also took down a law put in place by Macri’administration to prevent nepotism.
Most of the shock has been applied to the working class, the elders, etc. In fact, he lowered the Personal Goods tax, which made the upper class less taxable and re-issued the Gains Tax, with a formula that applied to workers who have “high” salaries.
The app thing, happened twice. First in the instance you mention. A phone line to denounce corruption, bribing and coercion from syndicates and unions was established, yes, but it had nothing to do with the app. The app just launched a message that said to users how the unions aren’t in favor of the working class people and such. If you are interested, I think I have screenshots of it.
On the economic front (which I admit it’s the best partbof his government given the results), yes, estabilization and stopping inflation were achieved, but as I said, through the suffering of the working class. Milei boast about salaries being better in dollars. What I believe he does not say is that not only most people receive the salarys in pesos, but most people didn’t have an inflation adjustement on its salary. So people’s power to consume decreased a lot.
This cultural war thingy he always goes on ramblin’ about it’s more of “ancap meets reality” where he is not so liberal but a social conservative. And those two things don’t go hand in hand at least when we talk about social stuff.
Also, while I understand his rethoric and character may derive from defending his (very unfounded and wacky, in my opinion) ideals, it is not acceptable to be ushering insults at everyone who thinks different than you.
In case of Congress, one senator was expulsed after being caught with an undeclared 200.000usd crossing from Argentina to Paraguay. And would’nt you know it, it’s the senator elected by Peronism who approved of the “Ley Bases” which allowed the vicepresident to add his vote (in order to break a tie) and pass the law.
Strange.
Well, I think I added enough context. I expect your answer!
Hope you have a great day and thank you for being so respectful and curious about what is happening. We could see things differently, but as long as we can talk about issues and be open about them, we’re on our way to make the world a better place, at least for us.
I know it sounds cheesy, but I believe that most of all this we talked about could have been prevented by people being vocal about their opinions and willing to debate more than just closing up and insulting others.
Salute, it’s been fun to talk about stuff and also i’m getting more information I missed so I thank you for that as well
I’m aware that Job states were practically severed, but I also think Milei has done it the legal way? I’ve seen discussions always pointing towards no-renewal of contracts rather than firing workers outright, if not shutting down entities which if it had followed the law, I think it’s best for Argentina’s people interests since doing that was also something he boasted about in his campaign, it’s bad for the workers of course but in any private environment, assuming the law is followed, would have the same results for any money-bleeding enterprise, again, as he promised to do so they (workers) probably saw it coming even and prepared accordingly
I wasn’t aware of the second usage of the state app, however what you mention about the first one’s message we would need the exact wording, given that wasn’t lying in Argentina’s case it seems and it doesn’t sound like a political attack or propaganda for other things than the hotline
About the economic front I think it’s the first time we collide, in all the discussions, news and analysis I have seen about Milei’s economic effects EVERYTHING I got from it indicated that Dollars were losing value against the Peso, and from Argentines getting paid in Dollars they stated they were becoming poorer, likewise there have been recent news about Brazilians going on vacation to Argentina to find that everything was extremely expensive in Dollars, comparing it to the last year where some said to have things practically gifted… so I am not sure if we’re talking about the same thing here, but all about it seems to compass that the Peso is increasing it’s value, while Salaries don’t increase that’s correct but the worth of them does, and Dollars lose value against the Peso
About his Social Conservativeness, yeah I have seen he has stances on that, I am not sure I about this exactly when, but I think he was asked about his Ideological stance in a recent interview from a British Podcaster (I can’t remember the name of right now but it was recent), and he replied by asking them if they wanted the Personal Answer or the Governmental Agenda one… point is I believe he has it straight to have his personal views out of the government agenda, but we’ll see
Wasn’t the Vice president a woman? but anyway, I guess that’s to be suspected yeah, whatever the case I hope it incentivizes to increase scrutiny bars, it’s very complicated to say it really had a tie to either field since cause and effect really benefit both sides
Hi, sorry that it took me so long to answer this one. Hmmm. I understand your point about the severance, but I need to underscore that even if it’s legal, it does not mean it is the right way to solve the situation. The severances are indiscriminate, not accounting really if the worker is good or not. And are motivated on ideologies much more than efficiency. For example, most of the “chainsaw” as he call his austerity measures, are done on the public healthcare system, public education system, and such. He is even withdrawing funding from Memory Sites (places where the 76’ dictatorship executed, tortured, raped, kidnapped the oposition).
But it is not cutting funding from the executive branches, legislative branches or judicial branches of the government, and also is trying to privatize many state-owned companies.
Just like the dictatorship did…
In case of the app thing, well, it is the second time it has done this.
Economically speaking there seems to be stability. Now, how much it will last, I can’t say. People are poorer now than in the last 20 years, prices still are skyhigh in much of the basic goods, at least in my understanding, and salaries have not matched yet the inflation the shock measures released. So workers are still losing economic power. Also, companies have more benefits (mostly not good for workers).
His agenda as I see it is selling the country to the highest bidder, basically. Being a Social Conservative, he just is a apathetic being who does not give a single flying fvck about those who are not in a comfortable position capable of resisting the measures. Nor he cares about upholding the Memory Thruth and Justice legacy we made this 40+ years. Hiis government is mostly composed of ex-neonazis, fascists, orthodox catholics (and surprisingly, orthodox jews in at least a few cases), anti-communist, etc.
The Vice-President is a woman. The daughter of a military men who refused to uphold democracy’s values and apologize for what the government did to the people during the “Dirty War”. A history revisionist who believes that the systematic kidnapping, torture, killing of the oposition, theft of newborns and rape commited by the state thugs, military, police, death squads were warranted in the fight against “subversion” and marxists.
This is my view, at least. Other Argentinians might differ slightly or more with me, and I’am a leftist, so bias might exist as with any other person. What i’m saying is not to discredit my opinion, but to help you grasp where i’m coming from. That is not to say I can’t be wrong.
Well, im sorry too for arriving late, my Lemmy app apparently stopped feeding me notifications until I manually logged on mi instance site, odd but I’m here now
Severance being done better is a good call but given the situation, what’s better than following the law that there was when he was established (and therefore did not dictate over) President? The thing is if said specific workers are given better escapes than what’s strictly legal and, on top of that cheapest it becomes analogous to the “Benefits of the Caste” he so much promised to go against, again voters mentioned they wanted exactly what he did, and anything better for them although clearly better for the individual civilian is also a contradiction of any other worker’s equality in terms of getting fired, just because they’re state contractors should they go with more than what’s established for everyone else? Is what I’m thinking without even accounting the wide range of accusations from citizenship about state workers being less than lawful (Which I have seen a lot)
Economic stability is a plus, being poorer now than in the last 20 years has almost been a constant for Argentina, it’s terrible that the chain has start at the top (corporations being benefited before workers) but given his projections at the assumption of the charge, it was expected and what follows should be the better for workers
he just is a apathetic being who does not give a single flying fvck about those who are not in a comfortable position capable of resisting the measures
I want to quote this specifically because IF I remember correctly, he did increase they government-aid for families to the double as soon as he got the charge, I think it was called “Asignacion Universal por Hijo” explicitly to help those in need for the upcoming changes, which was not well received on his supporting discussions I saw, yet still he did, so I’d rather believe that there is consideration for those people too
I’m aware of the background of the Vice-President, and I don’t have much compliments to make for her, as time has told she seems to be on the other side of the frame than Milei as she recently sought after increasing her own salary and other things Milei has been completely against since the beginning, I do think she’s very nationalist however, which seems to be something Argies can benefit from given her role on state defense. The atrocities of the military are not to be forgotten, but I personally do believe it is not their obligation to apologize for their blood
Thank you for the quick answer. Okay, so yesterday Milei attended the WEF conference at Davos where he denounced the “woke” agenda, compared homosexuality with children sexual abuse, defended Elon Musk who just a few days prior did a NAZI SALUTE on Trump’s Inauguration…
This has been a very weird week here in Argentina.
The atrocities of the military are not to be forgotten, but I personally do believe it is not their obligation to apologize for their blood
It is not that it is an obligation for her to apologize. She should not be trying to destroy 40 years of good policy making for remembrance by denying what the military did, what the context was.
I agree with you that the economic stability is good. Now, will it last? Are the circunstances good enough for the economy to re ignite itself? Because we have to take into account that we have a mostly frozen economy. We need to know if we can overstep the curve and get more job stability, less poverty. It is not that easy to do. He did got inflation to get as low as he could. Was it all he had to do? Not in the slightest, and those who payed for it were majorly common working class citizens.
Also, big companies have augmented their revenue a lot in this year.
Nevertheless, the point still stands on what will happen. That I’m not sure.
And I need to be abundantly clear, I’d love for the country to get better and de-stagnate. But I fear it could give rise to disproportionate amounts of power being redirected to the officialism party (which is composed of neo-nazis, genocide deniers, corporate leaders, flat earthers, religious maniacs) and violence being practiced in more physical ways to political opposition via legislative elections this week.
Democracy is the will of the people, but it shouldn’t be possible to make things undemocratic or give power to those who do not respect those institutions.
We will see. I hope i’m wrong.
It’s been a most constructive talk thus far, but i’m also leaning in towards “We’ll see” at this point, if we may meet again next year to further discuss progress i’ll gladly assist for I am also hoping for the best for the country.
It would be crazy to ask for you to keep this message on notifications for the rest of the year so if you don’t want I can do it instead with your next reply, until then i’ll keep my eyes open and for you in Argentina keep your face to the wind friend
Hello there again. I agree with your POVs. But, if you don’t mind, I’d like to clarify. While I agree that he has done some movements in order to decrease state job abuse, he has done it in a way which left 150.000 families without a job. That a lot of people sadly. He also took down a law put in place by Macri’administration to prevent nepotism. Most of the shock has been applied to the working class, the elders, etc. In fact, he lowered the Personal Goods tax, which made the upper class less taxable and re-issued the Gains Tax, with a formula that applied to workers who have “high” salaries.
The app thing, happened twice. First in the instance you mention. A phone line to denounce corruption, bribing and coercion from syndicates and unions was established, yes, but it had nothing to do with the app. The app just launched a message that said to users how the unions aren’t in favor of the working class people and such. If you are interested, I think I have screenshots of it.
On the economic front (which I admit it’s the best partbof his government given the results), yes, estabilization and stopping inflation were achieved, but as I said, through the suffering of the working class. Milei boast about salaries being better in dollars. What I believe he does not say is that not only most people receive the salarys in pesos, but most people didn’t have an inflation adjustement on its salary. So people’s power to consume decreased a lot.
This cultural war thingy he always goes on ramblin’ about it’s more of “ancap meets reality” where he is not so liberal but a social conservative. And those two things don’t go hand in hand at least when we talk about social stuff. Also, while I understand his rethoric and character may derive from defending his (very unfounded and wacky, in my opinion) ideals, it is not acceptable to be ushering insults at everyone who thinks different than you.
In case of Congress, one senator was expulsed after being caught with an undeclared 200.000usd crossing from Argentina to Paraguay. And would’nt you know it, it’s the senator elected by Peronism who approved of the “Ley Bases” which allowed the vicepresident to add his vote (in order to break a tie) and pass the law. Strange.
Well, I think I added enough context. I expect your answer! Hope you have a great day and thank you for being so respectful and curious about what is happening. We could see things differently, but as long as we can talk about issues and be open about them, we’re on our way to make the world a better place, at least for us. I know it sounds cheesy, but I believe that most of all this we talked about could have been prevented by people being vocal about their opinions and willing to debate more than just closing up and insulting others.
Salute, it’s been fun to talk about stuff and also i’m getting more information I missed so I thank you for that as well
I’m aware that Job states were practically severed, but I also think Milei has done it the legal way? I’ve seen discussions always pointing towards no-renewal of contracts rather than firing workers outright, if not shutting down entities which if it had followed the law, I think it’s best for Argentina’s people interests since doing that was also something he boasted about in his campaign, it’s bad for the workers of course but in any private environment, assuming the law is followed, would have the same results for any money-bleeding enterprise, again, as he promised to do so they (workers) probably saw it coming even and prepared accordingly
I wasn’t aware of the second usage of the state app, however what you mention about the first one’s message we would need the exact wording, given that wasn’t lying in Argentina’s case it seems and it doesn’t sound like a political attack or propaganda for other things than the hotline
About the economic front I think it’s the first time we collide, in all the discussions, news and analysis I have seen about Milei’s economic effects EVERYTHING I got from it indicated that Dollars were losing value against the Peso, and from Argentines getting paid in Dollars they stated they were becoming poorer, likewise there have been recent news about Brazilians going on vacation to Argentina to find that everything was extremely expensive in Dollars, comparing it to the last year where some said to have things practically gifted… so I am not sure if we’re talking about the same thing here, but all about it seems to compass that the Peso is increasing it’s value, while Salaries don’t increase that’s correct but the worth of them does, and Dollars lose value against the Peso
About his Social Conservativeness, yeah I have seen he has stances on that, I am not sure I about this exactly when, but I think he was asked about his Ideological stance in a recent interview from a British Podcaster (I can’t remember the name of right now but it was recent), and he replied by asking them if they wanted the Personal Answer or the Governmental Agenda one… point is I believe he has it straight to have his personal views out of the government agenda, but we’ll see
Wasn’t the Vice president a woman? but anyway, I guess that’s to be suspected yeah, whatever the case I hope it incentivizes to increase scrutiny bars, it’s very complicated to say it really had a tie to either field since cause and effect really benefit both sides
Hi, sorry that it took me so long to answer this one. Hmmm. I understand your point about the severance, but I need to underscore that even if it’s legal, it does not mean it is the right way to solve the situation. The severances are indiscriminate, not accounting really if the worker is good or not. And are motivated on ideologies much more than efficiency. For example, most of the “chainsaw” as he call his austerity measures, are done on the public healthcare system, public education system, and such. He is even withdrawing funding from Memory Sites (places where the 76’ dictatorship executed, tortured, raped, kidnapped the oposition). But it is not cutting funding from the executive branches, legislative branches or judicial branches of the government, and also is trying to privatize many state-owned companies. Just like the dictatorship did…
In case of the app thing, well, it is the second time it has done this.
Economically speaking there seems to be stability. Now, how much it will last, I can’t say. People are poorer now than in the last 20 years, prices still are skyhigh in much of the basic goods, at least in my understanding, and salaries have not matched yet the inflation the shock measures released. So workers are still losing economic power. Also, companies have more benefits (mostly not good for workers).
His agenda as I see it is selling the country to the highest bidder, basically. Being a Social Conservative, he just is a apathetic being who does not give a single flying fvck about those who are not in a comfortable position capable of resisting the measures. Nor he cares about upholding the Memory Thruth and Justice legacy we made this 40+ years. Hiis government is mostly composed of ex-neonazis, fascists, orthodox catholics (and surprisingly, orthodox jews in at least a few cases), anti-communist, etc.
The Vice-President is a woman. The daughter of a military men who refused to uphold democracy’s values and apologize for what the government did to the people during the “Dirty War”. A history revisionist who believes that the systematic kidnapping, torture, killing of the oposition, theft of newborns and rape commited by the state thugs, military, police, death squads were warranted in the fight against “subversion” and marxists.
This is my view, at least. Other Argentinians might differ slightly or more with me, and I’am a leftist, so bias might exist as with any other person. What i’m saying is not to discredit my opinion, but to help you grasp where i’m coming from. That is not to say I can’t be wrong.
Well, im sorry too for arriving late, my Lemmy app apparently stopped feeding me notifications until I manually logged on mi instance site, odd but I’m here now
Severance being done better is a good call but given the situation, what’s better than following the law that there was when he was established (and therefore did not dictate over) President? The thing is if said specific workers are given better escapes than what’s strictly legal and, on top of that cheapest it becomes analogous to the “Benefits of the Caste” he so much promised to go against, again voters mentioned they wanted exactly what he did, and anything better for them although clearly better for the individual civilian is also a contradiction of any other worker’s equality in terms of getting fired, just because they’re state contractors should they go with more than what’s established for everyone else? Is what I’m thinking without even accounting the wide range of accusations from citizenship about state workers being less than lawful (Which I have seen a lot)
Economic stability is a plus, being poorer now than in the last 20 years has almost been a constant for Argentina, it’s terrible that the chain has start at the top (corporations being benefited before workers) but given his projections at the assumption of the charge, it was expected and what follows should be the better for workers
I’m aware of the background of the Vice-President, and I don’t have much compliments to make for her, as time has told she seems to be on the other side of the frame than Milei as she recently sought after increasing her own salary and other things Milei has been completely against since the beginning, I do think she’s very nationalist however, which seems to be something Argies can benefit from given her role on state defense. The atrocities of the military are not to be forgotten, but I personally do believe it is not their obligation to apologize for their blood
Thank you for the quick answer. Okay, so yesterday Milei attended the WEF conference at Davos where he denounced the “woke” agenda, compared homosexuality with children sexual abuse, defended Elon Musk who just a few days prior did a NAZI SALUTE on Trump’s Inauguration… This has been a very weird week here in Argentina.
It is not that it is an obligation for her to apologize. She should not be trying to destroy 40 years of good policy making for remembrance by denying what the military did, what the context was.
I agree with you that the economic stability is good. Now, will it last? Are the circunstances good enough for the economy to re ignite itself? Because we have to take into account that we have a mostly frozen economy. We need to know if we can overstep the curve and get more job stability, less poverty. It is not that easy to do. He did got inflation to get as low as he could. Was it all he had to do? Not in the slightest, and those who payed for it were majorly common working class citizens. Also, big companies have augmented their revenue a lot in this year. Nevertheless, the point still stands on what will happen. That I’m not sure.
And I need to be abundantly clear, I’d love for the country to get better and de-stagnate. But I fear it could give rise to disproportionate amounts of power being redirected to the officialism party (which is composed of neo-nazis, genocide deniers, corporate leaders, flat earthers, religious maniacs) and violence being practiced in more physical ways to political opposition via legislative elections this week. Democracy is the will of the people, but it shouldn’t be possible to make things undemocratic or give power to those who do not respect those institutions. We will see. I hope i’m wrong.
It’s been a most constructive talk thus far, but i’m also leaning in towards “We’ll see” at this point, if we may meet again next year to further discuss progress i’ll gladly assist for I am also hoping for the best for the country.
It would be crazy to ask for you to keep this message on notifications for the rest of the year so if you don’t want I can do it instead with your next reply, until then i’ll keep my eyes open and for you in Argentina keep your face to the wind friend