This is something I think whatever lemmy 2.0 is going to be really needs to focus on.

Just be a content aggregator for ALL of the fediverse. Everything. One feed.

Or maybe more clever ways of integrating. But right now, we’re still relying on video mostly from YT (not peertube) and screenshots of things happening on mastodon. We need more connective tissue.

Its not defeatism. Its a basic understanding of how systems work, which you clearly don’t have. You being obtuse doesn’t change that. You and I can’t change the issue at play. Without scale, lemmy dies. Its not a debate and its killed plenty of projects long before it.

In other words, hope in one hand and shit in the other; see which one fills up first.

Without growing the user base, this project dies. Its not a debate.

Yeah. Huge improvement and my other account is on piefed.social

Not having it from the beginning though, it helped create this issue in declining usership, which will kill the entire project if we don’t address it.

I’ve lived through the birth growth and death of many former spaces which occupy a similar role as Lemmy. When users start to depart, its almost always destined for catastrophic collapse.

A big part of that is on the design side. We really need the ability to fork/ clone/ merge/ migrate communities across instances. Lemmy was designed to be an “entire” reddit replacement. Because of this, we end up with redundant communities with less activity. Migration of accounts and communities could effectively solve this issue.

Its possibly lemmy could have been designed such that communities of similar type could be aggregated into a single instance. For example, maybe you start a “snowboarding” community on .world, but when a sports focused instance pops up, you might want to migrate your community. A few instances build like this.

The fediverse is not a single amorphous bloc with the same overall goals of growth.

I mean, sure. I guess still people are on Fark. and Digg. And even still posting to Craigslist forums.

And growth is a matter of survival. You don’t grow, you don’t survive.

Sorry, I misspoke. The largest instances of lemmy are have been defederated, specifically world and ml.

The only argument I’m making is that almost all defederation is negatively impactful to fediverse growth.

You are railing about moral issues I don’t even disagree with. But there are basic, physical properties that networks have, that are scale dependent. There is no moralizing around that issue. And de-federation can and does occur all the time, its basically the norm between the major instances. And that has fundamentally crippled the growth of the fediverse (at least the lemmy side).

Just because I’m not bothering putting effort into responding to a slathering wall of text like you’ve composed, does nothing to change the fact that social networks, and actually, all large networked systems from the internet to a fungal colony, all base their survival in scale. I’ve done the work and shared it with those I’ve deemed worthy, here, regarding the network analyses I’ve built to run on the fediverse. Here’s a hint: you aren’t one of those.

Without scale, networked systems collapse. Without scale, complexity can’t emerge.

A big part of this is architectural and we had that discussion years ago here. There are design constraints built into the original envisioning of lemmy that pretty much force these limitations. The biggest issue being that each lemmy instance is built to effectively be an “entire clone” of a reddit like system. The second is activity pub related, in that users can not “migrate” their accounts or community’s to new instance, neither can we fork, clone, or merge a community.

The result is that we end up with duplicated communities, balkanized content, and an overall reduction in activity, which further suppress growth. There is no disagreement that the de-federation issue contributed directly to Lemmy’s decline. We were all here for it.

Yes. And its been detrimental to the growth of the fediverse.

The math that underpins large networked systems isn’t something you can disagree with. Smaller in those kinds of systems are always less sustainable. Instance level moderation choices like defederation have directly contributed to the balkanization (you can agree or disagree with if it’s a good thing to do so; the preference make no difference) of the Lemmy chunk of the fediverse.

Smaller, less networked systems are more unstable and less sustainable. Period.

It’s got nothing whatsoever to do with what I want.

It only has to do with the math of how large networked systems function.

Right now the fediverse is unstable and unsustainable. balkanization is a huge contributing factor.

It’s not a preference thing. If you want the fediverse to survive we all need it to be bigger and balkanization prohibits that

First, yes, fix it.

I wouldn’t use wood glue or cyanoacrylate. Get a proper tube of two part epoxy that will set foodsafe.

I’m just going to restart my point for clarity.

Any barriers to bringing on users into the fediverse at any level is destructive to the future survival of the fediverse. This is specifically an issue that came up during any of the waves of migration we see from the bad place.

At various times there have been bans, both temp and outright, for all kinds of reasons, for both agreeable and disagreeable reasons, but regardless the impact is destructive to the fediverse.

Social networks thrive on users and through scaling aquire different properties. It’s more about the math of what it takes to keep a stable network and there is no getting around that. The “come one come all” approach things like the bad place use allows them to capture that kind of growth and without it, it’s just not possible to have the kind of detailed and varied and populated network you would get otherwise.

There have been specific moderation choices that have significantly curtailed and hurt the growth of the fediverse on all sides. Defederation is a huge one. Overly dogmatic moderation is another.

Like I agree that I don’t want tankies content or their spam, but realistically the “tankie”-verse versus the rest-of-us-verse has crippled the projects growth.

No. It’s not. That would be hyper destructive to any chances the fediverse has of surviving.

Networks are almost always about quantity over quality.

based af and morally acceptable use of AI.

Whichever makes the story more interesting

What’s the etiquette for posting #mastodon or other federated posts on some of the other reddit-analogues? From what I see you can just mention a #piefed or #lemmy group in a post and it will create a

Go on…

Bruh I’m gonna grow so many teeth. I wonder if we’ll be able to get crocodile teeth.

Like can I get just one crocodile tooth that hangs over my lip?