Going all-in on a Wayland future
blogs.kde.org
Well folks, it’s the beginning of a new era: after nearly three decades of KDE desktop environments running on X11, the future KDE Plasma 6.8 release will be Wayland-exclusive! Support for X11 applications will be fully entrusted to Xwayland, and the Plasma X11 session will no longer be included.

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/39342270

Well folks, it’s the beginning of a new era: after nearly three decades of KDE desktop environments running on X11, the future KDE Plasma 6.8 release will be Wayland-exclusive! Support for X11 applications will be fully entrusted to Xwayland, and the Plasma X11 session will no longer be included.

  • makingStuffForFun@lemmy.ml
    9·
    1 day ago

    I use Talon voice. It’s software that let’s me use the pc still, due to write severe RSI.

    However, Wayland doesn’t allow a lot of functionality that tools like this need.

    Therefore, anyone who requires a tool similar to Talon, needs X11.

    KDE is out.

    • Domi@lemmy.secnd.me
      16·
      24 hours ago

      2027/2032 is still some time away.

      However, accessibility features provided by third-party applications may be worse in some aspects. Please open a bug report if you have any special requirements that we don’t cover yet! This is an active topic we’re very interested in improving.

      Let them know what you need.

    • flying_sheep@lemmy.ml
      8·
      1 day ago

      Wayland compositors lack the APIs necessary for Talon and Wayland support is not planned.

      Sucks that they just claim that and give up instead of trying to work together with Wayland compositors to make this happen.

      I don’t understand why they would drop you like this.

      • enumerator4829@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        51·
        24 hours ago

        Because instead of just using a common well defined API, every developer is supposed to ”work together with Wayland compositors”, of which there are many, none of which are up to feature parity with X. Working together with the (at least) three major compositors is far top much work for most projects, if you can even get them on board.

        Every compositor must reimplement everything previously covered by third party software, or at least define and reimplement APIs to cover that functionality. We have been screaming about this obvious design fuckup since Wayland was first introduced, but nooo, every frame is perfect.

        Take a look at https://arcan-fe.com/ for what a properly architected display server could look like instead of the mess we currently have with Wayland. I’m holding off on moving to Wayland for many reasons, and it wouldn’t surprise me if Arcan becomes mature and fully usable before Wayland. If I get to place a bet on either on Wayland or a few guys in a basement with a proper architecture, I know what I’ll put my money on.

          • enumerator4829@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            1·
            4 hours ago

            That list is hilarious. I especially love how gnome just gives up on Wayland protocols and wants everyone to run a sidechannel over dbus instead.

            This is why we can’t have nice things.

            • flying_sheep@lemmy.ml
              1·
              3 hours ago

              I don’t get what you mean. Isn’t the list just a status quo and not how things are supposed to be forever? What’s “hilarious” about somebody painstakingly going through all the features and checking how close they are?

              Like I wouldn’t put it past GNOME to give up on interoperability at the slightest inconvenience, but I don’t see that here?

              • enumerator4829@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
                1·
                22 minutes ago

                It’s hilarious that all of this was foreseen 17 years ago by basically everyone, and here is a nice list providing just those exact points. I’ve never seen a better structured ”told ya so” in my life.

                The point isn’t that the features are there or not, but how horrendously fragmented the ecosystem is. Implementing anything trying to use that mess of API surface would be insane to attempt for any open source project, even when ignoring that the compositors are still moving targets.

                (Also, holy shit the Gnome people really wants everyone to use dbus for everything.)

                Edit: 17 years. Seventeen years. This is what we got. While the list is status quo, it’s telling that it took 17 years to implement most of the features expected of a display server back in the last millenium. Most features, but not all.

                • flying_sheep@lemmy.ml
                  1·
                  11 minutes ago

                  Pretty good for mostly volunteers, hampered by recalcitrant project leads that actively sabotage any progress and consider “told you so” appropriate.

                  If anyone cared enough, they could have made that list 17 years ago, and pushed through a set of protocol extensions that allow talon to work.

                  Why did nobody do that?

                  It’s crazy to me that people complain now. It’s far too late for complaints.